APL Jobs: Are we all hobbyists? : APL

Where are the APL jobs? How much does an APL programmer get paid, in the
UK?

Judging by the APL forums, there are enough people doing APL or related
jobs; yet, there are never any vacancies.

APL programmers do not get paid

It is so much fun progamming APL that you have to pay for the privilege

> Where are the APL jobs?

The company I work for is hiring new APL developers right now. We are
looking for young (23/27) people for a full time position. They must be
based in Milano and speak, read and write fluently Italian, possess or
almost possess a degree in Physics, Mathematics or Engineering (preferably
not Computer Science). I think it's very unlikely that an English/American
candidate could match the requirements...
--
WildHeart'2k5

"AA2e72E" <aa2e72e@deletethisword.lycos.co.uk> wrote in message
news:52e8330a367f3060e2c94e48f5ae69ce@localhost.ta lkaboutprogramming.com...
> Where are the APL jobs? How much does an APL programmer get paid, in the
> UK?
>
> Judging by the APL forums, there are enough people doing APL or related
> jobs; yet, there are never any vacancies.
>

Hobbyist nothing.

Now that I know some APl2, I can
suck in a huge CSV, parse it any which way
I want, do massive computations,
row rearrangements, column insertions/deletions,
sorting, all of it with
a few lines of APL2
(thanks Ted et al, for showing
numerous times how easy it is)
and then shoot it back out again, all in
less time than it takes to say
"the hell with VBScript".

Jim Pannozzi

"AA2e72E" <aa2e72e@deletethisword.lycos.co.uk> wrote in
news:52e8330a367f3060e2c94e48f5ae69ce@localhost.ta lkaboutprogramming.com:

> Where are the APL jobs? How much does an APL programmer get paid, in the
> UK?
>
> Judging by the APL forums, there are enough people doing APL or related
> jobs; yet, there are never any vacancies.
>
>

Mention was made of how easy it was to do extensive manipulation of data
with few lines of APL. If you know enough APL, this is obvious, but it
stretches credibility if you try to convince a non-APL person that this is
possible. Incredible sales skills seem to be needed, and I don't consider
myself to be that good a sales person, and I don't speak Italian.

Right now, I'm looking for work. Up until recently, I did some work in
Perl, which is the closest to APL non-APL language I've seen. If anyone is
interested in seeing my résumé
(excuse the non-standard characters, even if this is an APL forum) please
send me a note, and I'll be happy to send you a copy.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
|\/| Randy A MacDonald | you can't pay for it,
|/\| ramacd@nbnet.nb.ca | even if you want to.
BSc(Math) UNBF'83 Sapere Aude | APL: If you can say it, it's done..
Natural Born APL'er |
----------------------------------------------------(INTP)----{ gnat }-

"Stefano "WildHeart" Lanzavecchia" <wildstf@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:dknvnq$k86$1@stargate1.inet.it...
> The company I work for is hiring new APL developers right now. We are
> looking for young (23/27) people for a full time position. They must be
> based in Milano and speak, read and write fluently Italian, possess or
> almost possess a degree in Physics, Mathematics or Engineering (preferably
> not Computer Science). I think it's very unlikely that an English/American
> candidate could match the requirements...

Isn't age discrimination illegal in Italy?

Cheers, Paul

Stefano \"WildHeart\" Lanzavecchia wrote:

> > Where are the APL jobs?
>
> The company I work for is hiring new APL developers right now. We are
> looking for young (23/27) people for a full time position. They must be
> based in Milano and speak, read and write fluently Italian, possess or
> almost possess a degree in Physics, Mathematics or Engineering (preferably
> not Computer Science). I think it's very unlikely that an English/American
> candidate could match the requirements...

This may be the problem with a lot of programming jobs. I do *not* mean
speaking Italian, or even being 23 to 27 years old. The problem as I see
it...
is that companies are *not* looking for programmers. Companies are looking
for physicists or chemists or economists who can also program well.

Programming is now looked at as a necessary ancillary skill...*not* the main
attraction anymore. IMHO.

>> The company I work for is hiring new APL developers right now. We are
>> looking for young (23/27) people for a full time position. They must be

> Isn't age discrimination illegal in Italy?

That's a good point. I suppose we would accept younger/older persons (I am
not the one to decide anyway) if it was worth it. My specification of the
age was in fact more an indication of the range where the required
characteristics are more likely but not exclusively to be found.
--
WildHeart'2k5

Stefano "WildHeart" Lanzavecchia wrote:
> My specification of the
> age was in fact more an indication of the range where the required
> characteristics are more likely but not exclusively to be found.

I guess it is a very common misconception that the best option is to
hire a young person

At the same time the qualifcations that are expected are very often
only possible in older people

A generation used to be counted something like 30 years

As people in general get healthier and older the fact that many older
people have the experience, education and the drive that is needed for
a job but those looking do not even try to evaluate them for the job

I know a few people who have been in lack of projects to work on for a
long time and they do not even get answers because many of those
looking at applications start sorting away all above a certain age

When I was learning to fly I met a lady who was 82 and just finished
learning to fly and she was still flying on her own last I heard many
years later

I know there is a huge difference between individuals how they age and
it has to do with their attitude to life more than the date they
happened to be born

It seems to me that many companies want young people for one main
reason - they're cheaper !
An old business partner of mine said " I'd rather pay 2 profis good
money than hire 10 idiots".
How right he is IMO ! ( idiots meaning - inexperienced(young) people of
course )