Moving to new form of usenet ideas? - c++

On Oct 8, 3:13 pm, "Jon Slaughter" <Jon_Slaugh...@Hotmail.com> wrote:
> Sorry for all the cross posting but I'm interesting in getting a serious
> discussion about how usenet has become lately.

Usenet is usenet. What you want is a discussion forum. There are
plenty
of implementations available freely that you may modify to suit your
needs.

Please, don't cross-post to unrelated newsgroups and understand that
you are currently part of this "spam" category. Time to use this
"spam-repellent" on yourself.


Jonathan

"Jonathan Mcdougall" <jonathanmcdougall@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1191843018.047481.325550@19g2000hsx.googlegroups.com...
> On Oct 8, 3:13 pm, "Jon Slaughter" <Jon_Slaugh...@Hotmail.com> wrote:
>> Sorry for all the cross posting but I'm interesting in getting a serious
>> discussion about how usenet has become lately.
>
> Usenet is usenet. What you want is a discussion forum. There are
> plenty
> of implementations available freely that you may modify to suit your
> needs.
>

I'm trying to see if the community is interested in moving into something
better.

> Please, don't cross-post to unrelated newsgroups and understand that
> you are currently part of this "spam" category. Time to use this
> "spam-repellent" on yourself.
>
>

Hmm... But yet its ok for you to do it? I knew someone would say such a
thing but I guess you rather me post individually to each group?

Fortunately there is a difference between what I posted and spam. I do not
in general post to multiple groups and I am not posting an irrelevant
message or trying to sell a product or waste peoples time. What I am asking
is relevant to all those that use usenet. It is a serious question please
respond with a serious answer.

And hell, if you hate cross posting then please don't do it yourself.... it
makes you look like a hypocrit.

> Fortunately there is a difference between what I posted and spam. I do
> not in general post to multiple groups and I am not posting an irrelevant
> message or trying to sell a product or waste peoples time. What I am
> asking is relevant to all those that use usenet. It is a serious question
> please respond with a serious answer.

Don't get me wrong though. Maybe I am the only one concerned here and maybe
I am wasting everyone's time... but compared to rest of the spam thats a
chance I'm willing to take.

On 2007-10-08 13:54, Jon Slaughter wrote:
> "Jonathan Mcdougall" <jonathanmcdougall@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1191843018.047481.325550@19g2000hsx.googlegroups.com...
>> On Oct 8, 3:13 pm, "Jon Slaughter" <Jon_Slaugh...@Hotmail.com> wrote:
>>> Sorry for all the cross posting but I'm interesting in getting a serious
>>> discussion about how usenet has become lately.
>>
>> Usenet is usenet. What you want is a discussion forum. There are
>> plenty
>> of implementations available freely that you may modify to suit your
>> needs.
>>
>
> I'm trying to see if the community is interested in moving into something
> better.

Most of us using the groups you have posted to are what people would
call tech-savvy, if we did not consider usenet good enough when weighing
all the pros and cons compared with the alternatives we would have moved
to something "better" long ago.

>> Please, don't cross-post to unrelated newsgroups and understand that
>> you are currently part of this "spam" category. Time to use this
>> "spam-repellent" on yourself.
>>
> Hmm... But yet its ok for you to do it? I knew someone would say such a
> thing but I guess you rather me post individually to each group?

A necessary evil in his case, and multiposting is even worse than cross-
posting.

> Fortunately there is a difference between what I posted and spam. I do not
> in general post to multiple groups and I am not posting an irrelevant
> message or trying to sell a product or waste peoples time. What I am asking
> is relevant to all those that use usenet. It is a serious question please
> respond with a serious answer.

The most common definition of SPAM that I have seen is undesired mail/
messages, and yours fall in that category. You claim that your post is
relevant to comp.lang.c++ but I can not see anything in your post that
have anything to do with C++.

In my experience the biggest problem with usenet is not traditional SPAM
(maybe because my newsserver have a good SPAM filter, what do I know)
but rather the many irrelevant posts. Few of those are made with any
"ill" intent (often it is just people who do not know any better) but
they still lowers the signal to noise ratio.

For those who can not stand some noise every now and then there are the
moderated groups like comp.lang.c++.moderated, but they you will also
have to live with the consequences of posing in a moderated newsgroup.

--
Erik Wikström

Jon Slaughter wrote:
> Sorry for all the cross posting but I'm interesting in getting a serious
> discussion about how usenet has become lately.
>
> Many people are moving away from usenet because of all the spam and cooks
> that have been showing up. The rate of spammer seem to be growing
> exponentially(ok, not really but it feels like it).
>
> I think maybe its time to do something about it. What I'd like to see happen
> is an "upgrade" to usenet. I do not like th forum based communiations that
> has sprung up lately but since it solves many of usenet's shortcommings I
> believe that will will take over.
>
> If many people feel the same way then maybe we can move on to something
> better and increase the efficiency and productivity that usenet was meant
> for.
>
> Some ideas I have are:
>
> 1. Cook repellent - Some method to prevent cooks from interrupting normal
> flow. Either having a voting scheme or some type of identifying means to
> either completely remove them or at least make it easier to avoid them.

I'd be in favor of that, to a degree. If you get a bad cook, simply
sending the meal back won't solve the problem.
>
> 2. Spam repellent - Similar to Cooks.

The worst would be cooks who prepare Spam. Though Spam is very
popular in some places (I understand that Hawaiians consume more
Spam than any other state in the US), I've never known a cook
who can prepare it well.

<snip>


Apologies in advance for waste of bandwidth,

Rick

* Jon Slaughter:
> Sorry for all the cross posting but I'm interesting in getting a serious
> discussion about how usenet has become lately.
>
> Many people are moving away from usenet because of all the spam and cooks
> that have been showing up. The rate of spammer seem to be growing
> exponentially(ok, not really but it feels like it).
>
> I think maybe its time to do something about it. What I'd like to see happen
> is an "upgrade" to usenet. I do not like th forum based communiations that
> has sprung up lately but since it solves many of usenet's shortcommings I
> believe that will will take over.
>
> If many people feel the same way then maybe we can move on to something
> better and increase the efficiency and productivity that usenet was meant
> for.
>
> Some ideas I have are:
>
> 1. Cook repellent - Some method to prevent cooks from interrupting normal
> flow. Either having a voting scheme or some type of identifying means to
> either completely remove them or at least make it easier to avoid them.

Use a newsreader with scoring.


> 2. Spam repellent - Similar to Cooks.

Use a spam filter and/or a smap-filtering news host (e.g.
news.individual.net).


> 3. Meta data - Have the ability to directly include graphics and things like
> TeX into messages. For those that do not want to view it they can disable it
> or have some other means to see it.

Use the MIME standard, supported by all newsreaders (except perhaps
Google (even your Outlook Express)).


> 4. Specific tools for groups - Different groups have different needs for
> communication. Mathematics groups need to efficiently communicate
> mathematical formulas while electronics need to communicate schematics.

Use the relevant XML-based standard in conjunction with MIME.


> 5. Moderation - Potentially give regular users of the group the ability to
> "quasi-moderate" or in general just have a wide range of options to have
> more control over groups(But not to much).

Use a newsreader with scoring.


> 6. Non-anomality or some way to slow down spammers. Maybe better routing
> data and such.

Use a spam filter and/or a spam-filtering news host (e.g.
news.individual.net).


> 7. Potentially "Backwards compatible" with usenet - have the ability to surf
> usenet with the same client to help make a smoother transition.

That would be Usenet.

Cheers, & hth.,

- Alf

PS: If not already evident, I think your posting was due to simple
ignorance.


[No follow ups, please]

--
A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is it such a bad thing?
A: Top-posting.
Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet and in e-mail?

On Mon, 08 Oct 2007 08:32:57 -0400, Rick Decker <rdecker@hamilton.edu>
wrote:

>Jon Slaughter wrote:
>> Sorry for all the cross posting but I'm interesting in getting a serious
>> discussion about how usenet has become lately.
>>
>> Many people are moving away from usenet because of all the spam and cooks
>> that have been showing up. The rate of spammer seem to be growing
>> exponentially(ok, not really but it feels like it).
>>
>> I think maybe its time to do something about it. What I'd like to see happen
>> is an "upgrade" to usenet. I do not like th forum based communiations that
>> has sprung up lately but since it solves many of usenet's shortcommings I
>> believe that will will take over.
>>
>> If many people feel the same way then maybe we can move on to something
>> better and increase the efficiency and productivity that usenet was meant
>> for.
>>
>> Some ideas I have are:
>>
>> 1. Cook repellent - Some method to prevent cooks from interrupting normal
>> flow. Either having a voting scheme or some type of identifying means to
>> either completely remove them or at least make it easier to avoid them.
>
>I'd be in favor of that, to a degree. If you get a bad cook, simply
>sending the meal back won't solve the problem.

I can't remember ever getting a bad idea from a cook. Whereas I've
gotten plenty from sacred cows.

>> 2. Spam repellent - Similar to Cooks.
>
>The worst would be cooks who prepare Spam. Though Spam is very
>popular in some places (I understand that Hawaiians consume more
>Spam than any other state in the US), I've never known a cook
>who can prepare it well.

I believe Spam was invented by Capt. James Cook. Possibly apochryphal.
I don't know who invented sacred cows. Possibly bad cooks.

>Apologies in advance for waste of bandwidth,

Not so far.

~v~~

On Mon, 8 Oct 2007 06:13:39 -0500, "Jon Slaughter"
<Jon_Slaughter@Hotmail.com> wrote:

>Sorry for all the cross posting but I'm interesting in getting a serious
>discussion about how usenet has become lately.
>
>Many people are moving away from usenet because of all the spam and cooks
>that have been showing up.

Really, you should try some of my bean recipes.

John

On Mon, 8 Oct 2007 06:13:39 -0500, "Jon Slaughter"
<Jon_Slaughter@Hotmail.com> wrote:

>Sorry for all the cross posting but I'm interesting in getting a serious
>discussion about how usenet has become lately.
>
>Many people are moving away from usenet because of all the spam and cooks
>that have been showing up. The rate of spammer seem to be growing
>exponentially(ok, not really but it feels like it).

I see very little spam on sed, maybe because I use Supernews.

You can ignore the kooks or play with them. Sometimes it's interesting
to research their obscessions. You can learn a lot about H2O2 or PV
solar or bogus audio stuff.

But what's this Mika Lalonde stuff? It seems to keep evading my kill
filters.


>5. Moderation - Potentially give regular users of the group the ability to
>"quasi-moderate" or in general just have a wide range of options to have
>more control over groups(But not to much).

Moderated groups tend to be dull or totally dead. The cure is worse
than the disease.

John