FORTH on Cell/PS-3

>> Does a FORTH, commercial or free, exist for the
>> Cell processor used in Sony's PlayStation 3
>> game console?
>
> A Forth written for the G5 should run on Cell shouldn't it?
> Adding the extensions to use that math crunchers might no be
> that hard.
>
> Mops (Mike's own programming system) is free and comes with
> source for compiling in a G4/G5 Macintosh. Mops uses the
> Yerk/Neon OO model and is very cool. Mike doesn't really
> support it anymore since he has no desire to rework it for
> the Intel Core2.

That must be PowerMops (?):

<http://powermops.com/>

<http://powermops.com/MopsManual/Assemblers/Contents.html>
68k and PowerPC Assemblers

<http://powermops.sourceforge.net/index.php/Main_Page>

<http://www.atpm.com/8.03/mops.shtml>
Introduction to Mops, including the object-oriented
programming part.


BTW: The link to Mops on this newsgroup's FAQ,
<http://www.faqs.org/faqs/computer-lang/forth-faq/part2/>,
is broken:

<http://www.netaxs.com/~jayfar/mops.html>


> Play stations are probably the cheapest source. Three in
> each aren't there?

One Cell processor. 6 usable SPUs. One lost on the yield
altar and one lost to Sony's decision to disable one.


> And they network with other PS3's?

Yes, normal Ethernet. 1 GBit/s (?). We use SSH to log into
our PS3 with Linux Yellow Dog Linux installed on it.


> How much does IBM charge for their Cell Blade?

About 20 times more than a PS3 costs. But then you get higher
double-precision performance. The PS3 is really only for
single-precision.


=========

I found 3 places in this newsgroup where FORTH on PS3 was
discussed. So it seems Charles Davis is working on
bootstrapping FORTH on PS3 (?).

From <http://shrinkster.com/11mn>:
Discussion of FORTH on PS3.
2008-07-24.
"But if I have any success in my efforts with the PS3,
I'LL BE BACK. Charles Davis",

From <http://shrinkster.com/11mp>:
Yet another actual discussion of FORTH on PS3.
2008-03-26.
"because the SPUs have limited local memory (256K), Forth
would have an advantage there.",

From <http://shrinkster.com/11mm>:
Actual discussion of FORTH on PS3.
2005-06-17.
"Reading about Forth multi-tasking in Stephen Pelc's book
... does not yet deal with the problems of multiple
tasks running on different processors in a shared-memory
machine",
"How forth is going to be put to writing APUlets I have no idea",


Regards,
Peter Mortensen

Peter Mortensen wrote:
>>> Does a FORTH, commercial or free, exist for the
>>> Cell processor used in Sony's PlayStation 3
>>> game console?
>>
>>
>> A Forth written for the G5 should run on Cell shouldn't it?
>> Adding the extensions to use that math crunchers might no be
>> that hard.
>>
>> Mops (Mike's own programming system) is free and comes with
>> source for compiling in a G4/G5 Macintosh. Mops uses the
>> Yerk/Neon OO model and is very cool. Mike doesn't really
>> support it anymore since he has no desire to rework it for
>> the Intel Core2.
>
>
> That must be PowerMops (?):
>
> <http://powermops.com/>
>
> <http://powermops.com/MopsManual/Assemblers/Contents.html>
> 68k and PowerPC Assemblers
>
> <http://powermops.sourceforge.net/index.php/Main_Page>
>
> <http://www.atpm.com/8.03/mops.shtml>
> Introduction to Mops, including the object-oriented
> programming part.
>
>
> BTW: The link to Mops on this newsgroup's FAQ,
> <http://www.faqs.org/faqs/computer-lang/forth-faq/part2/>,
> is broken:
>
> <http://www.netaxs.com/~jayfar/mops.html>
>
>
>> Play stations are probably the cheapest source. Three in
>> each aren't there?
>
>
> One Cell processor. 6 usable SPUs. One lost on the yield
> altar and one lost to Sony's decision to disable one.
>
>
>> And they network with other PS3's?
>
>
> Yes, normal Ethernet. 1 GBit/s (?). We use SSH to log into
> our PS3 with Linux Yellow Dog Linux installed on it.
>
>
>> How much does IBM charge for their Cell Blade?
>
>
> About 20 times more than a PS3 costs. But then you get higher
> double-precision performance. The PS3 is really only for
> single-precision.
>
>
> =========
>
> I found 3 places in this newsgroup where FORTH on PS3 was
> discussed. So it seems Charles Davis is working on
> bootstrapping FORTH on PS3 (?).
>
> From <http://shrinkster.com/11mn>:
> Discussion of FORTH on PS3.
> 2008-07-24.
> "But if I have any success in my efforts with the PS3,
> I'LL BE BACK. Charles Davis",

That was the 24th of July. It's now the end of August, and I'm still
waiting to get my hands on a PS3 to try something there. Wish me luck!
Chuck Davis.
>
> From <http://shrinkster.com/11mp>:
> Yet another actual discussion of FORTH on PS3.
> 2008-03-26.
> "because the SPUs have limited local memory (256K), Forth
> would have an advantage there.",
>
> From <http://shrinkster.com/11mm>:
> Actual discussion of FORTH on PS3.
> 2005-06-17.
> "Reading about Forth multi-tasking in Stephen Pelc's book
> ... does not yet deal with the problems of multiple
> tasks running on different processors in a shared-memory
> machine",
> "How forth is going to be put to writing APUlets I have no idea",
>
>
> Regards,
> Peter Mortensen
>

Charles Davis wrote:
> Peter Mortensen wrote:
>
>>>> Does a FORTH, commercial or free, exist for the
>>>> Cell processor used in Sony's PlayStation 3
>>>> game console?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> A Forth written for the G5 should run on Cell shouldn't it?

Not necessarily. It all depends on what machine code instructions are in
use. The 'CELL' base is roughly equivalent to the G3, with SOME of the
Altivec instructions. (G3 with all of the Altivec , = G4)
G4 -> G5 increased clock speed, don't know about any additional
instructions available.

Chuck D.

>>> Adding the extensions to use that math crunchers might no be
>>> that hard.
>>>
>>> Mops (Mike's own programming system) is free and comes with
>>> source for compiling in a G4/G5 Macintosh. Mops uses the
>>> Yerk/Neon OO model and is very cool. Mike doesn't really
>>> support it anymore since he has no desire to rework it for
>>> the Intel Core2.
>>
>>
>>
>> That must be PowerMops (?):
>>
>> <http://powermops.com/>
>>
>> <http://powermops.com/MopsManual/Assemblers/Contents.html>
>> 68k and PowerPC Assemblers
>>
>> <http://powermops.sourceforge.net/index.php/Main_Page>
>>
>> <http://www.atpm.com/8.03/mops.shtml>
>> Introduction to Mops, including the object-oriented
>> programming part.
>>
>>
>> BTW: The link to Mops on this newsgroup's FAQ,
>> <http://www.faqs.org/faqs/computer-lang/forth-faq/part2/>,
>> is broken:
>>
>> <http://www.netaxs.com/~jayfar/mops.html>
>>
>>
>>> Play stations are probably the cheapest source. Three in
>>> each aren't there?
>>
>>
>>
>> One Cell processor. 6 usable SPUs. One lost on the yield
>> altar and one lost to Sony's decision to disable one.
>>
>>
>>> And they network with other PS3's?
>>
>>
>>
>> Yes, normal Ethernet. 1 GBit/s (?). We use SSH to log into
>> our PS3 with Linux Yellow Dog Linux installed on it.
>>
>>
>>> How much does IBM charge for their Cell Blade?
>>
>>
>>
>> About 20 times more than a PS3 costs. But then you get higher
>> double-precision performance. The PS3 is really only for
>> single-precision.
>>
>>
>> =========
>>
>> I found 3 places in this newsgroup where FORTH on PS3 was
>> discussed. So it seems Charles Davis is working on
>> bootstrapping FORTH on PS3 (?).
>>
>> From <http://shrinkster.com/11mn>:
>> Discussion of FORTH on PS3.
>> 2008-07-24.
>> "But if I have any success in my efforts with the PS3,
>> I'LL BE BACK. Charles Davis",
>
>
> That was the 24th of July. It's now the end of August, and I'm still
> waiting to get my hands on a PS3 to try something there. Wish me luck!
> Chuck Davis.
>
>>
>> From <http://shrinkster.com/11mp>:
>> Yet another actual discussion of FORTH on PS3.
>> 2008-03-26.
>> "because the SPUs have limited local memory (256K), Forth
>> would have an advantage there.",
>>
>> From <http://shrinkster.com/11mm>:
>> Actual discussion of FORTH on PS3.
>> 2005-06-17.
>> "Reading about Forth multi-tasking in Stephen Pelc's book
>> ... does not yet deal with the problems of multiple
>> tasks running on different processors in a shared-memory
>> machine",
>> "How forth is going to be put to writing APUlets I have no idea",
>>
>>
>> Regards,
>> Peter Mortensen
>>