Multiple base classes in .NET - Framework and Interface Programming

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"Frank Hileman" <frankhil@no.spamming.prodigesoftware.com> spake the secret code
<#MTYrUgzHHA.464@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl> thusly:

>I agree with the quote "designers overuse inheritance as a reuse
>technique." One could qualify that by saying "inexperienced designers."

I don't know that this qualification is of much use since everyone
starts out as an inexperienced designer. The problem I have seen is
that people build up bad habits while inexperienced and then after
having used these bad habits for a long time, they call themselves
experienced, yet they are still a poor designer.

>We should not conclude that aggregation is preferable to inheritance in all
>contexts.

That's why its a *preference* and not an outright ban on inheritance.

>The Gof book is not a bible. [...]

There's no reason to get insulting by bringing religion into it.
--
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> Well, I've always heard that _public_ inheritance must be restricted to
> cases of is-a. But surely there are cases when protected inheritance is
> appropriate but public is not. For instance, if you are exposing a
> readonly collection to your users, it may be helpful to inherit a full
> featured collection privately, but make only the get accessors visible.

> Sure, you could use aggregation/forwarding, but here the object is-a
> readonly collection and also is-a writable collection, depending on the
> user. That to me just sounds like protected inheritance. Of course, you
> expose all the mutation functionality to your creator/owner by returning a
> pair of pointers from a factory method, one cast to the mutable base class
> and one not.
>
> Sadly, none of this is possible in .NET.

I don't think a language should restrict a user from doing this type of
thing but I personally find it extremely ugly. IMO (and it is a religious
issue) an interface is something that the "public" deals with and they
shoulsn't see anything else. If I use a vending machine to "download" a soft
drink, I want to see the interface only - coin slot, selection buttons,
change drop, etc. I don't want to see a second interface jutting out that
has meaning to the manufacuter only (even if I can't use it). It's unsightly
and confusing. The whole thing should be hidden which is not the case with
protected or private inheritance. Your own collection example is very ugly
in practice for instance (IMHO). This is because inheritance of this type
isn't normally done to extend a base class' behaviour by adding extra
functionality or even overriding existing behaviour. It's normally done to
support a new and specifc implementation meaning your new class requires its
own independent interface. A generic collection class for instance (say a
"vector" that actually supported derivation) will have many different
functions which become off-limits the moment I create a specific collection
of type T. My new collection is designed to handle T only which usually
involves very specific behaviour. It's not a "vector" from the user's
standpoint and shouldn't be seen that way. It's a collection of T and that's
how you want your users to see it (not as a "vector" even if it's
protected/private - it still violates the "is a" relationship from their
perspective). I also may not want them invoking the base class' "erase"
function, "capacity" function, "reserve" function, etc. I can inherit from
"vector" using "protected" or "private" and only expose what I want but
users can still see it's a "vector" which is an implementation detail they
shouldn't know about (especially since its functionality is off-limits). If
I add my own "erase" function for instance (maybe even calling it "delete")
then they'll now see two "erase" functions even if only one is accessible.
The entire situation is completely unnatural and confusing notwithstanding
the inconvenenience of aggregation since it requires new wrapper functions
you get for free using inheritance (although even with inheritance you may
need to replace a non-virtual base class function which leads to hiding
issues and/or dual functions in the derived class - this can result in
confusion and difficuties understanding the class even for those maintaining
it). Nevertheless, I readily acknowledge that aggregation is a maintenance
problem since you can wind up with many wrappers which often do little more
than delegate to others (resulting in code bloat, maintenance problems,
etc.).

Ben, you mentioned public, private and protected inheritance. My
understanding is that there is no conceivable use for protected inheritance,
and, indeed, Stroustrup felt that was a mistake.

///ark

"Larry Smith" <no_spam@_nospam.com> wrote in message
news:ese$6wgzHHA.1184@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>> Well, I've always heard that _public_ inheritance must be restricted to
>> cases of is-a. But surely there are cases when protected inheritance is
>> appropriate but public is not. For instance, if you are exposing a
>> readonly collection to your users, it may be helpful to inherit a full
>> featured collection privately, but make only the get accessors visible.
>
>> Sure, you could use aggregation/forwarding, but here the object is-a
>> readonly collection and also is-a writable collection, depending on the
>> user. That to me just sounds like protected inheritance. Of course, you
>> expose all the mutation functionality to your creator/owner by returning
>> a pair of pointers from a factory method, one cast to the mutable base
>> class and one not.
>>
>> Sadly, none of this is possible in .NET.
>
> I don't think a language should restrict a user from doing this type of
> thing but I personally find it extremely ugly. IMO (and it is a religious
> issue) an interface is something that the "public" deals with and they
> shoulsn't see anything else. If I use a vending machine to "download" a
> soft drink, I want to see the interface only - coin slot, selection
> buttons, change drop, etc. I don't want to see a second interface jutting
> out that has meaning to the manufacuter only (even if I can't use it).
> It's unsightly and confusing. The whole thing should be hidden which is
> not the case with protected or private inheritance. Your own collection
> example is very ugly

You were completely right... up until here. Non-public inheritance is
hidden from the user. Only members can cast to a private/protected base
class.

> in practice for instance (IMHO). This is because inheritance of this type
> isn't normally done to extend a base class' behaviour by adding extra
> functionality or even overriding existing behaviour. It's normally done to
> support a new and specifc implementation meaning your new class requires
> its own independent interface. A generic collection class for instance
> (say a "vector" that actually supported derivation) will have many
> different functions which become off-limits the moment I create a specific
> collection of type T. My new collection is designed to handle T only which
> usually involves very specific behaviour. It's not a "vector" from the
> user's standpoint and shouldn't be seen that way. It's a collection of T
> and that's how you want your users to see it (not as a "vector" even if
> it's

That's how they would see it -- via the public interfaces it implements.

> protected/private - it still violates the "is a" relationship from their
> perspective). I also may not want them invoking the base class' "erase"
> function, "capacity" function, "reserve" function, etc. I can inherit from
> "vector" using "protected" or "private" and only expose what I want but
> users can still see it's a "vector" which is an implementation detail they

How? Protected/private base classes are implementation details and as such
are hidden from the user.

> shouldn't know about (especially since its functionality is off-limits).
> If I add my own "erase" function for instance (maybe even calling it
> "delete") then they'll now see two "erase" functions even if only one is
> accessible.

Functions in derived classes with the same name but different signatures
hide base members, they do not overload. This is why.

> The entire situation is completely unnatural and confusing notwithstanding
> the inconvenenience of aggregation since it requires new wrapper functions
> you get for free using inheritance (although even with inheritance you may
> need to replace a non-virtual base class function which leads to hiding
> issues and/or dual functions in the derived class - this can result in
> confusion and difficuties understanding the class even for those
> maintaining


The using statement is a lot easier to maintain than a whole barrage of
trivial forwarders.

> it). Nevertheless, I readily acknowledge that aggregation is a maintenance
> problem since you can wind up with many wrappers which often do little
> more than delegate to others (resulting in code bloat, maintenance
> problems, etc.).

"Mark Wilden" <mwilden@communitymtm.com> wrote in message
news:%23eIE7chzHHA.2312@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
> Ben, you mentioned public, private and protected inheritance. My
> understanding is that there is no conceivable use for protected
> inheritance, and, indeed, Stroustrup felt that was a mistake.

To specify the base class of a template class, where the exact class is
chosen by a descendant.

template <typename T>
class S : protected T
{
};

class R : S<std::vector<Q>>
{
};

Naturally the class choosing the base class should have access to it, but
with private inheritance, R couldn't use std::vector<Q>.

Hi Richard,

Sorry, I meant bible in the slang sense. GoF should not be considered a
source of absolute wisdom.

Frank

"Richard" <legalize+jeeves@mail.xmission.com> wrote in message
news:%23$$velgzHHA.5772@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
>>The Gof book is not a bible. [...]
>
> There's no reason to get insulting by bringing religion into it.

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