The mac for Java programmers - Java

In article <8n3oa49lipvs93dfpqlco4fv02gt1i8n1t@4ax.com>,
Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> wrote:

> http://mindprod.com/bgloss/macintosh.html

Very nice! I would clarify that J2SE5 (1.5) is standard, but J2SE6 (1.6)
is available for later model Intel Macs (dual-core).

--
John B. Matthews
trashgod at gmail dot com
home dot woh dot rr dot com slash jbmatthews

In article <8n3oa49lipvs93dfpqlco4fv02gt1i8n1t@4ax.com>,
Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> wrote:

> I have composed a page with a summary of the MacIntosh which I hope
> will help Java programmers write code and instructions for the Mac.
>
> I don't have a Mac myself, so I would appreciate it if anyone with a
> Mac could check that I got it right. Additional lore to include, and
> suggested links welcome.
>
> see http://mindprod.com/bgloss/macintosh.html

I don't find this to be very accurate.

First of all, it's Macintosh, not MacIntosh. The name is an Apple
trademark. And that part about "fewer applications" isn't really very
meaningful -- it's a typical line used by anti-Mac types.

You state that 1.6 isn't supported when in fact it's been released,
though not for all Mac systems. You say that Java hides "many of the
peculiarities" of the Mac -- what peculiarities are those? All modern
Macs support a multi-button mouse (without even needing drivers) and the
right button works just like the single-button would if pressing
control. What's that part about "no set environment" supposed to mean?
Java on Windows gets much of its "environment" info from the Registry
and more from environment variables, while on other *nix variants it is
familiar with the environment variables. Like it or not, Mac OS X *is*
based on BSD. The references to \r instead of \r\n are a bit dated, and
overlook the fact that only Windows uses the latter, but in my
experience the end-of-line behavior of Mac OS X in Java mimics that in
Linux environments where I've tried it out. The shells you cite are the
*default* shells in those OS X releases, which means little to technical
users who can use any of a variety of shells -- including getting some
that aren't there in the beginning. And the part about not supporting
options on a command like rm...also not true.

Frankly, this sounds a lot like something put together by a person who's
not only relatively Mac-illiterate but also anti-Mac.
--
Steve W. Jackson
Montgomery, Alabama

On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 09:38:42 -0500, "Steve W. Jackson"
<stevewjackson@knology.net> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone
who said :

>Frankly, this sounds a lot like something put together by a person who's
>not only relatively Mac-illiterate but also anti-Mac.

I don't own a Mac. I have only got to play with my sister's for short
periods of time. She can't answer any of my technical questions.

All I could do in repeat what others have told me. That is why I
asked for people like you to review it.

I have rewritten the entry. You might have another look.

My biases? I used to be president of Apples BC. I headed the team
that wrote the first Mac application in Canada, the CSL Stock Charter.

Back in the days when installing a LAN was a big deal, a guy hired me
to install his Mac LAN. I was very reluctant. But it was a piece of
cake. I was impressed with how Apple had got serious about making
computers usable.
--

Roedy Green Canadian Mind Products
The Java Glossary
http://mindprod.com

On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 13:55:10 +0100, John B. Matthews
<nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> In article <8n3oa49lipvs93dfpqlco4fv02gt1i8n1t@4ax.com>,
> Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> wrote:
>
>> http://mindprod.com/bgloss/macintosh.html
>
> Very nice! I would clarify that J2SE5 (1.5) is standard, but J2SE6 (1.6)
> is available for later model Intel Macs (dual-core).
>

Specifically, it's only available for 64-bit Intel Macs. I have a 32-bit
Core Duo that is not supported by Apple's Java. Also, you need Leopard
(OS X 10.5) to use Apple's Java 6.

SoyLatte (http://landonf.bikemonkey.org/static/soylatte/) addresses some
of these problems with an OS X port of the FreeBSD version of Java. This
runs on 32-bit machines under Tiger (OS X 10.4). The problem with
SoyLatte is that, unlike Apple's offering, the UI is not nicely
integrated. You have to use X11 if you want to use AWT or Swing.

I believe that there are problems using applets with Apple's Java 6. I'm
sure I read somewhere that they don't work in Safari (and possibly Firefox
too?) because the browser is a 32-bit application whereas the Java plug-in
is 64-bit.

Dan.

--
Daniel Dyer
http://www.uncommons.org

On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 09:38:42 -0500, "Steve W. Jackson"
<stevewjackson@knology.net> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone
who said :

>Frankly, this sounds a lot like something put together by a person who's
>not only relatively Mac-illiterate but also anti-Mac.

Someone wrote recently pointing out that my Java glossary was very
windows-centric. Why was I so pro-windows? I am not. It is just
that I have a Vista computer and don't have the funds for a Linux and
Mac Box.

I have been trying to add more Linux and Mac content. e.g.
http://mindprod.com/bgloss/macintosh.html
http://mindprod.com/jgloss/macintoshfonts.html
This is a someone thankless task. When I post something somebody
tells me, someone else tells me it is a damned lie, and gets angry
when I don't change it. But how do I know which of the two is right?
With windows I can check nearly everything out for myself. With Linux
and Mac I am at the mercy of strangers who may or may not help to
resolve such issues.

I try always to present both the advantages and disadvantages of
anything I write about. I consider it childish to treat my
platform/software/IDE etc. as a sort of sports team I am supposed to
be loyal to. My job is to tell people useful information, not to hide
it.

--

Roedy Green Canadian Mind Products
The Java Glossary
http://mindprod.com

Roedy Green wrote:
> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 09:38:42 -0500, "Steve W. Jackson"
> <stevewjackson@knology.net> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone
> who said :
>
>> Frankly, this sounds a lot like something put together by a person who's
>> not only relatively Mac-illiterate but also anti-Mac.
>
> Someone wrote recently pointing out that my Java glossary was very
> windows-centric. Why was I so pro-windows? I am not. It is just
> that I have a Vista computer and don't have the funds for a Linux and
> Mac Box.
>
Linux, e g Ubuntu, is free and can easily be installed on your "Vista
computer", if you have disk space to spare. You can use dual boot to
choose Linux or Windows.

In article <nospam-7A7BC1.08551020082008@aioe.org>,
"John B. Matthews" <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> In article <8n3oa49lipvs93dfpqlco4fv02gt1i8n1t@4ax.com>,
> Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> wrote:
>
> > http://mindprod.com/bgloss/macintosh.html
>
> Very nice! I would clarify that J2SE5 (1.5) is standard, but J2SE6 (1.6)
> is available for later model Intel Macs (dual-core).

I see the updates you made as of 20-Aug-08. I'm not aware of any "lack
of a set environment".

--
John B. Matthews
trashgod at gmail dot com
home dot woh dot rr dot com slash jbmatthews

In article <nospam-5A2861.13472220082008@aioe.org>,
"John B. Matthews" <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> In article <nospam-7A7BC1.08551020082008@aioe.org>,
> "John B. Matthews" <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:
>
> > In article <8n3oa49lipvs93dfpqlco4fv02gt1i8n1t@4ax.com>,
> > Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> wrote:
> >
> > > http://mindprod.com/bgloss/macintosh.html
> >
> > Very nice! I would clarify that J2SE5 (1.5) is standard, but J2SE6 (1.6)
> > is available for later model Intel Macs (dual-core).
>
> I see the updates you made as of 20-Aug-08. I'm not aware of any "lack
> of a set environment".

The link provided in the latest update does clarify what's meant by "set
environment" -- essentially the ability to set any environment variable
value at a command prompt in Windows systems. But so far as I know,
this is ****ogous to using any shell's technique to set an environment
variable. Java is platform agnostic here (as of 1.5) in that it
provides a way of reading the environment into a Map. And I'm unaware
of any prohibition against using it on a Mac.
--
Steve W. Jackson
Montgomery, Alabama

In article <fvcoa41plrfjmb4cvi9nsmq9bjd97bdh98@4ax.com>,
Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> wrote:

> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 09:38:42 -0500, "Steve W. Jackson"
> <stevewjackson@knology.net> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone
> who said :
>
> >Frankly, this sounds a lot like something put together by a person who's
> >not only relatively Mac-illiterate but also anti-Mac.
>
> I don't own a Mac. I have only got to play with my sister's for short
> periods of time. She can't answer any of my technical questions.
>
> All I could do in repeat what others have told me. That is why I
> asked for people like you to review it.
>
> I have rewritten the entry. You might have another look.
>
> My biases? I used to be president of Apples BC. I headed the team
> that wrote the first Mac application in Canada, the CSL Stock Charter.
>
> Back in the days when installing a LAN was a big deal, a guy hired me
> to install his Mac LAN. I was very reluctant. But it was a piece of
> cake. I was impressed with how Apple had got serious about making
> computers usable.

I did take another look, and it's considerably better now. I'm still
not sure why you wish to address what you call the "quirky" spelling, as
I don't think it's any more quirky than the choice of "Vista" by M$ or
Ubuntu or other names.

I'm not 100% certain, but I don't think it's true that Macs still use
the \r line terminator -- at least not in Java, where they behave like
any other *nix implementation. And you'll find that fewer and fewer Mac
users have a single button mouse these days. It's all Apple sells, but
many of us (especially techies) have been using a multi-button for years.

I think you're probably still getting a jumble of opinions tossed at
you, so I wouldn't presume to take potshots...but this is greatly
improved.

= Steve =
--
Steve W. Jackson
Montgomery, Alabama